Camless engine vids

[NHMR2]

i guess what i mean, is the major innovation is showing mostly from the smaller guys. big-wig corporate companies like GM, Ford, Toyota, Nissan etc. just arent being as "innovative" as they used to be. i mean sure, they come up with some cool gizmo here and there, but you just dont see any real improvements. not like they used to be anyways

[why?]

i guess what i mean, is the major innovation is showing mostly from the smaller guys. big-wig corporate companies like GM, Ford, Toyota, Nissan etc. just arent being as "innovative" as they used to be. i mean sure, they come up with some cool gizmo here and there, but you just dont see any real improvements. not like they used to be anyways

Ok, what are you calling innovative then? I'd say a completely different shock is pretty good. And Fiat is not a small company by anyone's definition.

But big companies aren't going to let anyone know what they are doing. The Magneride came out of nowhere. The rotary engine was not precisely widely advertised when mazda first started using them. The Prius is sort of a gigantic leap, right? Toyota first produced one in 97, well before everyone else. No one knew it was coming. Nissan was the first to use the CVT in a completely different way, and use it well for real engines. Of course Volvo who used it originally was never really a small car maker.

The thing they don't do is say,"here, this is what we are working on that you will see in 4 or 5 years." Because they know the second they do the clock starts ticking on someone else doing it better.

[Sean]

So... too bad koen(garble) doesnt seem too interested in putting this in one of the big boy toys yet... Id really like to see what this camless system can do on a large powerplant...

[NHMR2]

I guess what i'm getting at is major innovation. "reinventing the wheel" so to speak. I just feel like we aren't seeing anything spectacular from the big guys anymore. We used to of course, and of course there are new technologies and ways. What I mean is things like this. Internal combustion engines without camshafts. Its just interesting.

[Boosted Euro]

Article from 2001 on camless engine technology .

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_0910/article.html

I guess what i'm getting at is major innovation. "reinventing the wheel" so to speak. I just feel like we aren't seeing anything spectacular from the big guys anymore. We used to of course, and of course there are new technologies and ways. What I mean is things like this. Internal combustion engines without camshafts. Its just interesting.

Article from 2000

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2000/05/29/302932/index.htm

Siemens Automotive, the big German components supplier, has been working on no-cam engines for several years. So have two consulting-engineering companies, FEV Motorentechnik in Aachen, Germany, and Aura Systems, in El Segundo, Calif. Engineer Wieland Bruch at BMW's Munich headquarters says his company is collaborating with Siemens on a camless gasoline car-engine design tied in with a souped-up electrical system. Engines of this type, the company claims, have achieved fuel savings of 10% compared with conventional ones, along with reduced emissions and greater oomph.

BMW.. not a one of the big boys....

[Sean]

^^reading some of that was interesting stuff... lol at international.. "will have the system implemented in all their engines by 2007"... sooo... what happened? lol

and "the next automotive standard for electrical will be a 42V system"...?? .... doubt it.. lol


Need a machine shop.. start building a homemade engine... mad scientist style..

[Boosted Euro]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camless

Camless engines are not without their problems though. Common problems include high power consumption, accuracy at high speed, temperature sensitivity, weight and packaging issues, high noise, high cost, and unsafe operation in case of electrical problems.

Camless valve trains have long been investigated by several companies, including Renault, BMW, Fiat, Valeo, General Motors, Ricardo, Lotus Engineering, Ford and Cargine. [1][2][3][4] Some systems are commercially available, although not in production car engines.

2003

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/08/21/technology/circuits/21next.html

When Siemens VDO Automotive, in partnership with BMW, built a prototype camless engine four years ago, it came up with a three-part system. In place of cams it used solenoids, electromagnetically controlled plungers that are already widely used in cars for things like electric door locks.

While an electronic valve control system doesn't need mechanical power from the crankshaft, it does need to know what the crankshaft and the pistons driving it are doing. In a normal car, the belt or chain that connects crankshaft to camshaft ensures proper timing; that is, no valve remains open when its cylinder's piston is at the top of its travel. Such a situation would seriously damage a motor.

In its camless version, Siemens prevents such mistiming by using sensors that detect the position of the crankshaft and thus the pistons. Finally, the new engine was given yet another powerful computer to make sure everything works in sequence. ''When an eight-cylinder engine with four valves per cylinder is running at 6,000 r.p.m. there's a lot to do,'' said Michael Gauthier, director of corporate technology in Siemens's automotive division.

The prototype engine was installed in a 3-series BMW sedan. It worked but had several significant shortcomings. For one thing, the solenoids and the additional computer power taxed the car's already overburdened electrical system. Mr. Gauthier said that cars would have to make a long-awaited move to 42-volt electrical systems (from the current 12 volts) before electronic valve control would be practical.

^^ interesting

For car makers, the system's least attractive aspect was its price relative to camshafts. And there was a problem that made the engine unattractive to buyers, particularly those who associate BMW with smoothly running engines. As anyone who has opened a car with electric locks knows, solenoids are far from silent. ''I saw the vehicle, and all you heard when it was running was slap, slap, slap,'' Mr. Gauthier said.

Motorola believes that the control computer could be programmed to soften and quiet the action of the solenoids. Other electronic valve-control designs have relied on different parts to push the valves open.

A device that used piezoelectric crystals, which produce electricity when bent, was quiet and cut the power burden. But current piezoelectric devices must be about 8 to 10 inches high to operate engine valves. The result, Mr. Gauthier said, is an engine ''that looks something like a porcupine'' and will not fit under the hood of most cars.

[Sean]

hmm... I wonder what kind of fail-safes they have if the decide not to use a return spring...


Edit: Ill have to rewatch but i think they said they plan on a spring... probably cheaper anyway...

[g96nt]

That isn't really true. The smaller more unknown manufacturers are the ones to make videos and tell. Huge difference. This is free PR for a company that will never sell many cars.

To me, the latest real innovation was GM's Magneride, oh wait, they sold that to some chinese. Beijing West Industries Magneride suspension. And it is being licensed by a ton of manufacturers. You can't get much bigger than GM.

From what I remember, magneride was bose, not GM.